AN 9 The Book of the Nines – Navakanipāta > AN 9.38 Brahmin Cosmologists

Numbered Discourses 9.38 – Aṅguttara Nikāya 9.38

4. The Great Chapter – 4. Mahāvagga

AN 9.38 Brahmin Cosmologists – Lokāyatikasutta

1.1

Then two brahmin cosmologists went up to the Buddha, and exchanged greetings with him.

Atha kho dve lokāyatikā brāhmaṇā yena bhagavā tenupasaṅkamiṁsu; upasaṅkamitvā bhagavatā saddhiṁ sammodiṁsu.

1.2

When the greetings and polite conversation were over, they sat down to one side and said to the Buddha:

Sammodanīyaṁ kathaṁ sāraṇīyaṁ vītisāretvā ekamantaṁ nisīdiṁsu. Ekamantaṁ nisinnā kho te brāhmaṇā bhagavantaṁ etadavocuṁ:

2.1

“Master Gotama, Pūraṇa Kassapa claims to be all-knowing and all-seeing, to know and see everything without exception, thus:

“Pūraṇo, bho gotama, kassapo sabbaññū sabbadassāvī aparisesaṁ ñāṇadassanaṁ paṭijānāti:

2.2

‘Knowledge and vision are constantly and continually present to me, while walking, standing, sleeping, and waking.’

‘carato ca me tiṭṭhato ca suttassa ca jāgarassa ca satataṁ samitaṁ ñāṇadassanaṁ paccupaṭṭhitan’ti.

2.3

He says:

So evamāha:

2.4

‘With infinite knowledge I know and see that the world is infinite.’

‘ahaṁ anantena ñāṇena anantaṁ lokaṁ jānaṁ passaṁ viharāmī’ti.

2.5

And the Jain leader Nāṭaputta also claims to be all-knowing and all-seeing, to know and see everything without exception, thus:

Ayampi, bho gotama, nigaṇṭho nāṭaputto sabbaññū sabbadassāvī aparisesaṁ ñāṇadassanaṁ paṭijānāti:

2.6

‘Knowledge and vision are constantly and continually present to me, while walking, standing, sleeping, and waking.’

‘carato ca me tiṭṭhato ca suttassa ca jāgarassa ca satataṁ samitaṁ ñāṇadassanaṁ paccupaṭṭhitan’ti.

2.7

He says:

So evamāha:

2.8

‘With infinite knowledge I know and see that the world is finite.’

‘ahaṁ anantena ñāṇena anantaṁ lokaṁ jānaṁ passaṁ viharāmī’ti.

2.9

These two claim to speak from knowledge, but they directly contradict each other. Which one of them speaks the truth, and which falsehood?”

Imesaṁ, bho gotama, ubhinnaṁ ñāṇavādānaṁ ubhinnaṁ aññamaññaṁ vipaccanīkavādānaṁ ko saccaṁ āha ko musā”ti?

3.1

“Enough, brahmins.

“Alaṁ, brāhmaṇā.

3.2

Leave this aside:

Tiṭṭhatetaṁ:

3.3

‘These two claim to speak from knowledge, but they directly contradict each other. Which one of them speaks the truth, and which falsehood?’

‘imesaṁ ubhinnaṁ ñāṇavādānaṁ ubhinnaṁ aññamaññaṁ vipaccanīkavādānaṁ ko saccaṁ āha ko musā’ti.

3.4

I will teach you the Dhamma.

Dhammaṁ vo, brāhmaṇā, desessāmi,

3.5

Listen and pay close attention, I will speak.”

taṁ suṇātha, sādhukaṁ manasi karotha, bhāsissāmī”ti.

3.6

“Yes sir,” those brahmins replied.

“Evaṁ, bho”ti kho te brāhmaṇā bhagavato paccassosuṁ.

3.7

The Buddha said this:

Bhagavā etadavoca:

4.1

“Suppose there were four men standing in the four quarters. Each of them was extremely fast, with an extremely mighty stride.

“Seyyathāpi, brāhmaṇā, cattāro purisā catuddisā ṭhitā paramena javena ca samannāgatā paramena ca padavītihārena.

4.2

They’re as fast as a light arrow easily shot across the shadow of a palm tree by a well-trained expert archer with a strong bow.

Te evarūpena javena samannāgatā assu, seyyathāpi nāma daḷhadhammā dhanuggaho sikkhito katahattho katūpāsano lahukena asanena appakasirena tiriyaṁ tālacchāyaṁ atipāteyya;

4.3

Their stride was such that it spanned from the eastern ocean to the western ocean.

evarūpena ca padavītihārena, seyyathāpi nāma puratthimā samuddā pacchimo samuddo

4.4

Then the man standing in the east would say:

atha puratthimāya disāya ṭhito puriso evaṁ vadeyya:

4.5

‘I will reach the end of the world by traveling.’

‘ahaṁ gamanena lokassa antaṁ pāpuṇissāmī’ti.

4.6

Though he’d travel for his whole lifespan of a hundred years—pausing only to eat and drink, go to the toilet, and sleep to dispel weariness—he’d die along the way, never reaching the end of the world.

So aññatreva asitapītakhāyitasāyitā aññatra uccārapassāvakammā aññatra niddākilamathapaṭivinodanā vassasatāyuko vassasatajīvī vassasataṁ gantvā appatvāva lokassa antaṁ antarā kālaṁ kareyya.

4.7

Then the man standing in the west …

Atha pacchimāya disāya …pe…

4.8

Then the man standing in the north …

atha uttarāya disāya …

4.9

Then the man standing in the south would say:

atha dakkhiṇāya disāya ṭhito puriso evaṁ vadeyya:

4.10

‘I will reach the end of the world by traveling.’

‘ahaṁ gamanena lokassa antaṁ pāpuṇissāmī’ti.

4.11

4.12

Why is that?

Taṁ kissa hetu?

4.13

I say it’s not possible to know or see or reach the end of the world by running like this.

Nāhaṁ, brāhmaṇā, evarūpāya sandhāvanikāya lokassa antaṁ ñāteyyaṁ daṭṭheyyaṁ patteyyanti vadāmi.

4.14

But I also say there’s no making an end of suffering without reaching the end of the world.

Na cāhaṁ, brāhmaṇā, appatvāva lokassa antaṁ dukkhassa antakiriyaṁ vadāmi.

5.1

These five kinds of sensual stimulation are called the world in the training of the Noble One.

Pañcime, brāhmaṇā, kāmaguṇā ariyassa vinaye lokoti vuccati.

5.2

What five?

Katame pañca?

5.3

Sights known by the eye that are likable, desirable, agreeable, pleasant, sensual, and arousing.

Cakkhuviññeyyā rūpā iṭṭhā kantā manāpā piyarūpā kāmūpasaṁhitā rajanīyā;

5.4

Sounds known by the ear …

sotaviññeyyā saddā …pe…

5.5

Smells known by the nose …

ghānaviññeyyā gandhā …

5.6

Tastes known by the tongue …

jivhāviññeyyā rasā …

5.7

Touches known by the body that are likable, desirable, agreeable, pleasant, sensual, and arousing.

kāyaviññeyyā phoṭṭhabbā iṭṭhā kantā manāpā piyarūpā kāmūpasaṁhitā rajanīyā;

5.8

These five kinds of sensual stimulation are called the world in the training of the Noble One.

ime kho, brāhmaṇā, pañca kāmaguṇā ariyassa vinaye lokoti vuccati.

6.1

Take a bhikkhu who, quite secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from unskillful qualities, enters and remains in the first absorption, which has the rapture and bliss born of seclusion, while placing the mind and keeping it connected.

Idha, brāhmaṇā, bhikkhu vivicceva kāmehi vivicca akusalehi dhammehi savitakkaṁ savicāraṁ vivekajaṁ pītisukhaṁ paṭhamaṁ jhānaṁ upasampajja viharati.

6.2

This is called a bhikkhu who, having gone to the end of the world, meditates at the end of the world.

Ayaṁ vuccati, brāhmaṇā, ‘bhikkhu lokassa antamāgamma, lokassa ante viharati’.

6.3

Others say of them:

Tamaññe evamāhaṁsu:

6.4

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

6.5

And I also say this:

Ahampi hi, brāhmaṇā, evaṁ vadāmi:

6.6

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

7.1

Furthermore, take a bhikkhu who, as the placing of the mind and keeping it connected are stilled, enters and remains in the second absorption …

Puna caparaṁ, brāhmaṇā, bhikkhu vitakkavicārānaṁ vūpasamā …pe… dutiyaṁ jhānaṁ …

7.2

third absorption …

tatiyaṁ jhānaṁ …

7.3

fourth absorption.

catutthaṁ jhānaṁ upasampajja viharati.

7.4

This is called a bhikkhu who, having gone to the end of the world, meditates at the end of the world.

Ayaṁ vuccati, brāhmaṇā, ‘bhikkhu lokassa antamāgamma lokassa ante viharati’.

7.5

Others say of them:

Tamaññe evamāhaṁsu:

7.6

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

7.7

And I also say this:

Ahampi hi, brāhmaṇā, evaṁ vadāmi:

7.8

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

8.1

Furthermore, take a bhikkhu who, going totally beyond perceptions of form, with the ending of perceptions of impingement, not focusing on perceptions of diversity, aware that ‘space is infinite’, enters and remains in the dimension of infinite space.

Puna caparaṁ, brāhmaṇā, bhikkhu sabbaso rūpasaññānaṁ samatikkamā paṭighasaññānaṁ atthaṅgamā nānattasaññānaṁ amanasikārā ‘ananto ākāso’ti ākāsānañcāyatanaṁ upasampajja viharati.

8.2

This is called a bhikkhu who, having gone to the end of the world, meditates at the end of the world.

Ayaṁ vuccati, brāhmaṇā, ‘bhikkhu lokassa antamāgamma lokassa ante viharati’.

8.3

Others say of them:

Tamaññe evamāhaṁsu:

8.4

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

8.5

And I also say this:

Ahampi hi, brāhmaṇā, evaṁ vadāmi:

8.6

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

9.1

Furthermore, take a bhikkhu who enters and remains in the dimension of infinite consciousness. …

Puna caparaṁ, brāhmaṇā, bhikkhu sabbaso ākāsānañcāyatanaṁ samatikkamma ‘anantaṁ viññāṇan’ti viññāṇañcāyatanaṁ upasampajja viharati …pe…

9.2

the dimension of nothingness …

sabbaso viññāṇañcāyatanaṁ samatikkamma ‘natthi kiñcī’ti ākiñcaññāyatanaṁ upasampajja viharati …pe…

9.3

the dimension of neither perception nor non-perception.

sabbaso ākiñcaññāyatanaṁ samatikkamma nevasaññānāsaññāyatanaṁ upasampajja viharati.

9.4

This is called a bhikkhu who, having gone to the end of the world, meditates at the end of the world.

Ayaṁ vuccati, brāhmaṇā, ‘bhikkhu lokassa antamāgamma lokassa ante viharati’.

9.5

Others say of them:

Tamaññe evamāhaṁsu:

9.6

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

9.7

And I also say this:

Ahampi hi, brāhmaṇā, evaṁ vadāmi:

9.8

‘They’re included in the world, and haven’t yet left the world.’

‘ayampi lokapariyāpanno, ayampi anissaṭo lokamhā’ti.

10.1

Furthermore, take a bhikkhu who, going totally beyond the dimension of neither perception nor non-perception, enters and remains in the cessation of perception and feeling. And, having seen with wisdom, their defilements come to an end.

Puna caparaṁ, brāhmaṇā, bhikkhu sabbaso nevasaññānāsaññāyatanaṁ samatikkamma saññāvedayitanirodhaṁ upasampajja viharati, paññāya cassa disvā āsavā parikkhīṇā honti.

10.2

This is called a bhikkhu who, having gone to the end of the world, meditates at the end of the world. And they’ve crossed over clinging to the world.”

Ayaṁ vuccati, brāhmaṇā, ‘bhikkhu lokassa antamāgamma lokassa ante viharati tiṇṇo loke visattikan’”ti.

10.3

Sattamaṁ.